2000 FBP #293 58k miles on BaT

[Sort of Fast]

Eh, they're all the same to me. Survivor, restore, modified, or un-modified. 40k is simply too high. Only winner here is the seller unless we have yet another buyer that's just there to collect and have it sit around for the next decade only to make a marginal profit. There were several comments on BAT even stating there really is a line not many would cross for the price as it's near NSX territory. This just tells me there are too many idiots buying these. The chassis itself it not hard to find, and in this day and age it's almost too easy to replicate this car with any 90's Honda.

[Dave7CDMTYPER]

Eh, they're all the same to me. Survivor, restore, modified, or un-modified. 40k is simply too high. Only winner here is the seller unless we have yet another buyer that's just there to collect and have it sit around for the next decade only to make a marginal profit. There were several comments on BAT even stating there really is a line not many would cross for the price as it's near NSX territory. This just tells me there are too many idiots buying these. The chassis itself it not hard to find, and in this day and age it's almost too easy to replicate this car with any 90's Honda.

The market price is what buyers will pay for it. So you can't argue with that. Maybe there is a bubble for ITR prices kind of like the NSX's are experiencing, but ITR's are pretty rare so maybe not. Just b/c you won't pay 40k for an R (me either tbh), doesn't mean a lot of other people won't.

[Dc2-ProductionS]

Eh, they're all the same to me. Survivor, restore, modified, or un-modified.

Riiiiiiight......

[Sort of Fast]

Eh, they're all the same to me. Survivor, restore, modified, or un-modified.

Riiiiiiight......

Obviously missing my point, but I suppose posting in a fanboi page this response is expected. Referring to the chassis is really all that most track enthusiasts go for if they can get it cheap like I did, and most people here. Anything else can be easily built around it. I guess I've just built too many of these cars at this point though and look at the car for what it is. If I took a base model and built it to R spec, you wouldn't be able to tell a difference in how it drives, but hey you have an overpriced R. Way to go.

[Lturner]

Obviously missing my point, but I suppose posting in a fanboi page this response is expected. Referring to the chassis is really all that most track enthusiasts go for if they can get it cheap like I did, and most people here. Anything else can be easily built around it. I guess I've just built too many of these cars at this point though and look at the car for what it is. If I took a base model and built it to R spec, you wouldn't be able to tell a difference in how it drives, but hey you have an overpriced R. Way to go.

I get what you are saying. As I have two type r's that are the below standard. I wouldn't want them any other way. But you could say the same thing about a lot of cars. Like the E30 M3. Performance wise is very easy to replicate yet look at their price tags. We are all fan boys of something. No one is disagreeing you can get a regular integra shell and drop a few grand into it and make the performance top the Type R, yet the price will never reflect that of a Type r. Would I ever buy a caR just to sit the garage? Hell no, But not all owners want to track/race them. So why waste 40K on an overpriced car? Because they phucking can. And no one can change my mind that the Type R is the greatest FWD car every made!!

Keep killing it in GTA. I enjoy your instagram posts.

[Dc2-ProductionS]

Obviously missing my point, but I suppose posting in a fanboi page this response is expected. Referring to the chassis is really all that most track enthusiasts go for if they can get it cheap like I did, and most people here. Anything else can be easily built around it. I guess I've just built too many of these cars at this point though and look at the car for what it is. If I took a base model and built it to R spec, you wouldn't be able to tell a difference in how it drives, but hey you have an overpriced R. Way to go.

Not missing your point at all.... Let me ask you a question though.... Did they label the GSR as the best handling FWD car ever? How about a RS? Maybe it was a LS? .... Right.... Because you CANT make just another Integra like an ITR... Can you change the chassis and its rear arches? How about added thickness in the rear wheelhouses? Upper girders? How about the rear damper gusset? The rear upper roof rail?

Oh right..... I forgot... its all the same....

Every GTO is a Judge right? Every Charger came with the 440 barrel carb in it? You're right... It's just another Integra....I forgot who I was talking to... The author of the "Hype R" article.......

Not special at all, thats why its the ONLY production vehicle to win back to back to back World Challenge championships. Ya know... The most successful car model in the HISTORY OF WORLD CHALLENGE. Most wins, poles, and championships than ANY OTHER MODEL before or since.... But it was just another Integra they used for that.

I love seeing them used for track purpose. It's the original intent. I also love seeing them in showroom condition. It's a collector. But to say it makes no difference if it's original, modified, restored, etc is just a silly statement. I guarantee when someone asks what kind of car you have or track or are building you say Integra Type R.... Not an Integra.

[Dc2-ProductionS]

If all you care about is tracking it..... then restored, modded, or title status means nothing. That I agree. But this caR has gotten to a point that it's more of a collector and GEH than a truck slut. To each his own and every owner does whatever THEY want to do, 100%

[Sort of Fast]

Obviously missing my point, but I suppose posting in a fanboi page this response is expected. Referring to the chassis is really all that most track enthusiasts go for if they can get it cheap like I did, and most people here. Anything else can be easily built around it. I guess I've just built too many of these cars at this point though and look at the car for what it is. If I took a base model and built it to R spec, you wouldn't be able to tell a difference in how it drives, but hey you have an overpriced R. Way to go.

Not missing your point at all.... Let me ask you a question though.... Did they label the GSR as the best handling FWD car ever? How about a RS? Maybe it was a LS? .... Right.... Because you CANT make just another Integra like an ITR... Can you change the chassis and its rear arches? How about added thickness in the rear wheelhouses? Upper girders? How about the rear damper gusset? The rear upper roof rail?

Oh right..... I forgot... its all the same....

Every GTO is a Judge right? Every Charger came with the 440 barrel carb in it? You're right... It's just another Integra....I forgot who I was talking to... The author of the "Hype R" article.......

Not special at all, thats why its the ONLY production vehicle to win back to back to back World Challenge championships. Ya know... The most successful car model in the HISTORY OF WORLD CHALLENGE. Most wins, poles, and championships than ANY OTHER MODEL before or since.... But it was just another Integra they used for that.

I love seeing them used for track purpose. It's the original intent. I also love seeing them in showroom condition. It's a collector. But to say it makes no difference if it's original, modified, restored, etc is just a silly statement. I guarantee when someone asks what kind of car you have or track or are building you say Integra Type R.... Not an Integra.

It is a bit odd that you mostly proved my point about the chassis though. Most opt for the chassis if they can get it cheap. Otherwise, it's nothing special really and other ITR parts are easily attainable such as the motor, trans, susp, and brakes from places like HMO. I've literally proved this by building one cheap. The best FWD of all time? So forget the DC5, EP3, FD2, EK9...etc...those cars were just udder rubbish of course. Also, forget cars like the Peugot 205, GTI, Focus RS, Renault Megane RS...etc. Coming from a background in racing/tracking I've driven so many FWD's that the DC2 isn't all that impressive. It's a fun, high revving, good handling car. I don't put it up on a pedestal and pretend it's the greatest thing since 25 years ago though, and I certainly don't see a need to preserve so many of them. I would argue it's a fun beginner track car at best that's just hilarious to modify and make faster like any FWD platform. I will say yet again, if I handed you an RS and turned it into a Type R spec car you wouldn't be able to tell in terms of how it drives. This isn't like a Lancer to Lancer Evo conversion, or WRX to WRX STI conversion. It's far more simple than that. Also, the Integra chassis is actually quite rigid already from the factory along with chassis's like the EG. There are several RS, LS, GSR's that own Nasa TT records in TTE, TTD, and TTC. If I were a racing team back in the day like RealTime, of course I'd pick up an ITR over the other models because it came better equipped at a reasonable cost, thus saving the team time/money, but they still had to develop the chassis further and change the entire setup. Simple, yet very effective. Nowadays any Honda can be fun with simple modifications. IMO, a Type R really isn't necessary unless you get it for a decent price when all the options are weighed. I suppose it's best to say nothing though on these types of sales now, but I just find it very odd that people enjoy seeing the prices increase on these rather than trying to get them cheaper. Are they collector cars or fun cars to drive? They really cannot be both at this point with the prices we're seeing them go for. I don't mean to offend anyone that loves this car, but I'm just being realistic. There's a point to where this car really doesn't make sense to buy unless you're going to re-sell it or you just have money to

[Dc2-ProductionS]

It is a bit odd that you mostly proved my point about the chassis though. Most opt for the chassis if they can get it cheap. Otherwise, it's nothing special really and other ITR parts are easily attainable such as the motor, trans, susp, and brakes from places like HMO. I've literally proved this by building one cheap. The best FWD of all time? So forget the DC5, EP3, FD2, EK9...etc...those cars were just udder rubbish of course. Also, forget cars like the Peugot 205, GTI, Focus RS, Renault Megane RS...etc. Coming from a background in racing/tracking I've driven so many FWD's that the DC2 isn't all that impressive. It's a fun, high revving, good handling car. I don't put it up on a pedestal and pretend it's the greatest thing since 25 years ago though, and I certainly don't see a need to preserve so many of them. I would argue it's a fun beginner track car at best that's just hilarious to modify and make faster like any FWD platform. I will say yet again, if I handed you an RS and turned it into a Type R spec car you wouldn't be able to tell in terms of how it drives. This isn't like a Lancer to Lancer Evo conversion, or WRX to WRX STI conversion. It's far more simple than that. Also, the Integra chassis is actually quite rigid already from the factory along with chassis's like the EG. There are several RS, LS, GSR's that own Nasa TT records in TTE, TTD, and TTC. If I were a racing team back in the day like RealTime, of course I'd pick up an ITR over the other models because it came better equipped at a reasonable cost, thus saving the team time/money, but they still had to develop the chassis further and change the entire setup. Simple, yet very effective. Nowadays any Honda can be fun with simple modifications. IMO, a Type R really isn't necessary unless you get it for a decent price when all the options are weighed. I suppose it's best to say nothing though on these types of sales now, but I just find it very odd that people enjoy seeing the prices increase on these rather than trying to get them cheaper. Are they collector cars or fun cars to drive? They really cannot be both at this point with the prices we're seeing them go for. I don't mean to offend anyone that loves this car, but I'm just being realistic. There's a point to where this car really doesn't make sense to buy unless you're going to re-sell it or you just have money to

Have ANY of the cars you mentioned been labeled by magazines like road and track as the best handling FWD production car? I think, i might be wrong here, but I'm pretty sure Road and Track has a bit more seat time than you. And they may have a type of standard or procedure for testing car after car after car to do comparisons.

I would argue that an experienced race driver would be able to tell the difference of an RS in "Type R' spec form in comparison to an actual ITR.

I love your signature also. "ITR Cult Following: A group of people that has a set of beliefs in which the ITR is viewed as being the bestest FWD ever made, everyone else is wrong." - We didn't make the statement. And I never said that there arent better cars out there. Not once. My intital comment that got you all bunched up was to you saying theyre all the same. I don't agree with that statement. Thats my opinion. You seem quite caught up in this community and the swirl around it yourself. Some people throw shade at the caR, (like your article) others lust and love the caR for what it is and what it has accomplished. To each his own.

Def the "bestest" though... for sure...

[Sort of Fast]

It is a bit odd that you mostly proved my point about the chassis though. Most opt for the chassis if they can get it cheap. Otherwise, it's nothing special really and other ITR parts are easily attainable such as the motor, trans, susp, and brakes from places like HMO. I've literally proved this by building one cheap. The best FWD of all time? So forget the DC5, EP3, FD2, EK9...etc...those cars were just udder rubbish of course. Also, forget cars like the Peugot 205, GTI, Focus RS, Renault Megane RS...etc. Coming from a background in racing/tracking I've driven so many FWD's that the DC2 isn't all that impressive. It's a fun, high revving, good handling car. I don't put it up on a pedestal and pretend it's the greatest thing since 25 years ago though, and I certainly don't see a need to preserve so many of them. I would argue it's a fun beginner track car at best that's just hilarious to modify and make faster like any FWD platform. I will say yet again, if I handed you an RS and turned it into a Type R spec car you wouldn't be able to tell in terms of how it drives. This isn't like a Lancer to Lancer Evo conversion, or WRX to WRX STI conversion. It's far more simple than that. Also, the Integra chassis is actually quite rigid already from the factory along with chassis's like the EG. There are several RS, LS, GSR's that own Nasa TT records in TTE, TTD, and TTC. If I were a racing team back in the day like RealTime, of course I'd pick up an ITR over the other models because it came better equipped at a reasonable cost, thus saving the team time/money, but they still had to develop the chassis further and change the entire setup. Simple, yet very effective. Nowadays any Honda can be fun with simple modifications. IMO, a Type R really isn't necessary unless you get it for a decent price when all the options are weighed. I suppose it's best to say nothing though on these types of sales now, but I just find it very odd that people enjoy seeing the prices increase on these rather than trying to get them cheaper. Are they collector cars or fun cars to drive? They really cannot be both at this point with the prices we're seeing them go for. I don't mean to offend anyone that loves this car, but I'm just being realistic. There's a point to where this car really doesn't make sense to buy unless you're going to re-sell it or you just have money to

Have ANY of the cars you mentioned been labeled by magazines like road and track as the best handling FWD production car? I think, i might be wrong here, but I'm pretty sure Road and Track has a bit more seat time than you. And they may have a type of standard or procedure for testing car after car after car to do comparisons.

I would argue that an experienced race driver would be able to tell the difference of an RS in "Type R' spec form in comparison to an actual ITR.

I love your signature also. "ITR Cult Following: A group of people that has a set of beliefs in which the ITR is viewed as being the bestest FWD ever made, everyone else is wrong." - We didn't make the statement. And I never said that there arent better cars out there. Not once. My intital comment that got you all bunched up was to you saying theyre all the same. I don't agree with that statement. Thats my opinion. You seem quite caught up in this community and the swirl around it yourself. Some people throw shade at the caR, (like your article) others lust and love the caR for what it is and what it has accomplished. To each his own.

Def the "bestest" though... for sure...

You just did make the statement right there...lol. I'll have to simply agree to disagree. There are lots of opinions about this car in general, what it should be or what it shouldn't be. Like you said to each his own, and I suppose if you sell off an ITR for crazy $$ then more power to you. I won't comment much on Road and Track, but it's very similar to MotoIQ or TrackTuned which I write for occasionally. It's written by people with track experience, but all of us are driving enthusiasts at heart. We had a lot more people agreeing with us as track guru's about the climbing prices of these cars on if it's even worth it, but understandably it was more controversial, but I believe important to discuss nonetheless. Both Austin Cabot or Adam Jabay will agree as well. Perhaps I just see things differently.

One footnote to this--- I've built, tuned, and raced cars for the past 10 years doing things with Time Attack and NASA. I'm also a certified instructor and work with students on a regular basis and help develop fundamental skills. I would say my experience with these cars is quite decent, but I'm also open minded as to how these cars are built and how to improve them, as do many in Time Attack nowadays (GarageWork, JDMYard, OrangeBall, MightyMouse, PZTuning...etc). Lots of records to go after!